crazy geometry problems SOLVED and some things to improve.

Paulov

26-10-2006 10:56:26

CRAZY GEOMETRY
I´ve had geometries that no Reset X-form no Reset pivot, in resume no trick has been able to solve up today.
I´m talking about totally destroyed scenes when switching on the ofusion viewport that where perfectly displayed in the max viewport.

I´ve restarted with ofusion since I got quite depressed whit this tool seeing that there was no way to go with it.

I´ve finally found the solution to those problems :!:

Its so silly that it nearly makes me ungry :x

Those geometries where being imported from VRML format.
And they had some small green null objets. As in huge scenes they could be count by hundreds, I leaved them there, and since the scene was not working fine in ofusion I thought that it didnt worth to clean them.

FInally the las week decided to import All my finished VRML scenes to max format, reescale them and make them Ogre-ready.

In this process I realised that after cleaning a building and leaving only the geometry, it was rendering ok, totally black, but the geometry was on its place. wow.
So I started to clean this boxes in all scenes; some scenes later, I found that doing this one by one was killing me, so I identified what kind of objet it was --> helpers --in select by name--. so now its a matter of seconds to make it ofusion ready an vrml scene.

So, if you are having similar problems, that cant be resolved with Reset X.. etc.. chek if you have helpers, and kill them all, they are bad boys.



GROUPS
Well, I thought that groups where working ok, since they where going to be revised for this version. But they are behabing very badly, moving from its place the grouped geometry. See the image.

We need the groups to have our scene tidy and move objets that are formed by several elements.
--> Dont tell me to attach them jiji, I´ll do that just before exporting them to ogre.



WORKING WITH X-REF OBJETS.
THe X-ref are working at 50%
I´ve a Plaza that is formed by a central park and surrounded by buildings.
Everything is X-ref so that I cand edit every element independently.
Even if the element, for example a building, is rendering ok alone, when importing it to teh main plaza file, may or may not work, depending on the stars or the sun position, so that should be fixed.
The only way I´ve found to solve this is by making an attach to the objet that comes as X-ref. This is not nice for the workflow, so should be done as follows.

Once the scene is finished Pack all the resources in a Folder by File-->Archive.
Uncompress all and reorder it in the way you want.
Open each scene and attach all the objets.
Make your lightmaps.
Open the main scene file and theck that all is working fine.
The scene is ready to load in Ogre>>>>


LOD
Such an important thing for RT enviroments.... whell I think that up to date there is no way to make a geometry LOD in oFusion. So Just coment that it is extremely necesary.

Me personally would create a button in the modiffier stack with the following options.

1)Number of Lod levels, 2 by default

Each level with 2 buttons
1.1 ) "select geometry" that allows you to select this Lod level geometry in the scene.

1.2)"Browse"that allow you to select an external file.

2)Each level "activation distance".

3)[may be for a further release] fade LOD, so that the lod changes its level smoothly by facing. This should also have changeable value in seconds.


Some other things:: that would be fine to improve/add but are not a must.

CAMERA MOVEMENT
The camera displacements is still quite rough. needs to be improved.

PARTICLES.
Even if not creating a full particle generator, because with the excelent "particle acelerator" its not a total need for now. It would be just fine to make oFusion able to repressent them, and make possible to place in the scene, and may be attach them to scene objets.


CAST SHADOWS ON/OFF
In the objets properties would be fine an option like cast shadow on/off.
And make it available when multiple objets are selected.

MIP MAPPING
A general mip mapping distance control option in the scene menu.

BIAS FACTOR
Add in the objet properties a bias factor control. So that we can tell the engine wich objets goes over another.


in those images you can see the problems I´ve when activating shadows since I´ve objets that need to be at the same Y. I solved by rising some of them quite a bit, by doing this they project shadow and an extrange effect occurs.

Scene loader for dumps
oFusion makes possible to use Ogre to artists.... yes... but only to use Ogre inside max. The "scene loader" still involves some programming that if even silly for a programer it is too much for an artist.
Would be fine and stand alone utility that could let you select the file you want to become an .exe. By defining the initial resolution, renderer etc.

have a nice day________ __ _ _

Lioric

26-10-2006 16:39:03

Very good suggestions and recommendations

1. CRAZY GEOMETRY: is not because of the helpers, but because the helpers are the parent of the group, this has been fixed by some time by now in the Pro version, and will be in the next CE version

2. GROUPS: fixed in Pro version too

3. WORKING WITH X-REF OBJETS: i will review it, but it will be faster if you send a scene file were this can be tested

4. LOD: automatic lod support was fixed in Pro version

5. CAST SHADOWS ON/OFF: added to the list, expect it to be in the next version

6. BIAS FACTOR: this is a per material value (pass material), and it supported, in the the Pass material you can set its value.

From the material section of the "User's Guide":


Depth Bias
Sets the the bias value used in this pass to avoid graphic issues when rendering coplanar polygons.


You need to consider that the CE version gets cumulative updates only, most of your issues has been fixed, and will be in the next update

Vectrex

27-10-2006 02:57:12

but you can turn per object shadows on/off in the native max properties window?

Paulov

27-10-2006 20:50:49

1. CRAZY GEOMETRY: is not because of the helpers, but because the helpers are the parent of the group, this has been fixed by some time by now in the Pro version, and will be in the next CE version


aha, well, those parental relationship create nasty effects.
Now I´m having similar problems with data inported from CAD, and I´m unable to solve it, blocks are treated with parental relationships in MAX... but since it has ben fixed, I leave this by now.


3. WORKING WITH X-REF OBJETS: i will review it, but it will be faster if you send a scene file were this can be tested


--> I think I´ll finish retouching my scene this weekend, I´ll send you the scene packed with all the resources.
--> may be I´ll send you different versions (with x-refs attached unatached etc...)

4. LOD: automatic lod support was fixed in Pro version
well, may be you understood me right, but to ensure...
I was not speaking about automatic lods, I was speaking more a bout LOD levels that has been generated manually, so that each level is represented by a geometry modelled&selected by the user.

About the fading in the LODs, Falagard has something developed in this theme.

I saw working this perfectly in GTA3, where the urgan furniture, cars etc apeared smoothly by fading from nothing.


5. CAST SHADOWS ON/OFF: added to the list, expect it to be in the next version

Eih Vectrex you are right!. By using the standard MAX properties you can disable the objet from casting shadows easily.



6. BIAS FACTOR: this is a per material value ....

nice!! didnt. know about it. Ill chek it.

I´ll continue with the lightmaps and post soon some results.
I also want to start working with normal maps creating them with Nvidias DDs photoshop plugin. I´m looking for a fast way to implement them... this thing after mastering the lighmaps....

pablo___ _